Centerpointe Community

Spring Gobblers

2007-04-02T06:10:00.000-06:00

Well I'm back. I have spent the last several days preparing for, and taking my oldest son on the Missouri Youth Spring Turkey Hunt. We had an absolute blast from the tornado sirens sending us out of our camp site to a nearby tornado shelter right down to packing up our tents to drive home. Much of our time was spent either in the woods or down at the lake but that wasn't the best part for me... while I absolutely love teaching my son to hunt, and I was thrilled to watch him get excited as the gobblers would gobble back at our calls... the best part was the one on one time I got to spend with him talking, laughing and sharing our lives. It sure seems like our daily lives simply don't contain that kind of interaction. Of this realization I am saddened. I should be capitalizing on time spent in conversation with my children on a daily basis, yet life often seems to have me preoccupied with other things.
I am thankful for my trip, and more awakened to my own need to spend time with him in normal life. I hope this trip will hold special memories for him, but I hope more that the rest of our time together as he grows into a young man and adulthood will hold more and fonder memories of his dad than this one weekend does!
See you with more exciting post as I get back to my normal routine... oh ya, I guess I will spend the next few weeks getting ready for my turkey hunting trip... I love spring time!

Keep It Simple Stupid!

2007-03-27T11:12:00.000-06:00

Yes, you did hear me correctly. I said it correctly, Sometimes we are just too stupid for simplicity. Unfortunatly I think we have made the life of Christ, the life we Christians are supposed to live soooo complicated.
A friend reminded me yesterday of this verse from the Bible: "the Lord has told you what is good,and this is what he requires of you:to do what is right, to love mercy,and to walk humbly with your God." (Micah 6:8)
KISS! keep it simple stupid! I think it is kind of profound how we catagorize our lives of faith and put levels on our spirituality. Jesus said all of the law and the prophets can be summed up in this "Jesus replied, "'You must love the Lordyour God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. A second is equally important: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'(Matt 22:37-40)
Why don't we just start right here and live this first, before anything else?
So I pose this question: can Christianity be reduced to such simplicity?

What do you think?

Soccer Again

2007-03-24T06:02:00.000-06:00

Well it's another Saturday, time for a full day at the soccer fields spent coaching, cheering, hollering at refs and praying I dont loose my Christianity in front of the kids (or the Adults who think I'm perfect :)... good thing there are none of those present!)
In coaching soccer one of the things I focus on is the ability to recognize the weaknesses in our teammates so we can assist them in their weakness and make the "team" stronger. I wonder if Christians spent less time worrying about what their spiritual appearance was, and more time living real while looking for ways to serve others in their area of weakness if the whole community of faith would become stronger and more vibrant?
I'm guessing thats why God said in His word to Samual that God doesnt see things like man see's things, man judges the outward appearance (i.e. do we look holy enough to the other people who are trying to look holy) while God judges our hearts.
I pray we get this heart thing down soon so we can give up the nonsense of our pious religion and begin to start impacting people's lives through the grace and empowerment of God...in our weakness!

To quote from O'Rielly: "What say you?"

Bob's House Fire

2007-03-22T06:26:00.000-06:00

For anyone interested in seeing the damage done to Bob and Michelle's house the pictures can be viewed here: Bob Carder – pictures after the fire

Please continue to pray for Bob and Michelle as they struggle through the next few months. They have lost everything. Again if you would like to help with some of their needs email us at centerpointediscipleship@comcast.net

Wedded Bliss

2007-03-20T11:49:00.000-06:00

It is March 20th, the day that 14 years ago I watched as my beautiful Bride strolled down the isle of a small church to take my hand. I remember back to how, on the first day I saw her I knew in my heart that this beauty would be my bride... She however was not that easily convinced. I thank God every day that she heard in her heart that He wanted us together. Wedded Bliss? Hardly! Marraige is always a work in progress, and we have had our days of work till we sweat to make it. Still I wake to find her, always by my side, always beautiful, and thankfully: Always my beautiful Bride.

Thank you Liela for your faithfulness all these years. You will forever be my beautiful bride!

Carl Van Vliet

Fire

2007-03-19T05:49:00.000-06:00

Bob and Michelle Carder have suffered a house fire. Michelle is unharmed but Bob is in the Hospital in St. Louis.

For those of you who dont know who Bob is he is someone Liela and I call a our friend, he serves the Lord through the Missionary Church USA denomination, a former Senior Pastor now he is responsible for missional church development in the midwest district (I have no clue what his title is) and he has been helping Liela and I hash through some of our issues with church and help us as we develop what God is doing here in Independence. He often comments here on this site and always trys to encourage everyone to find their real mission in life.

Bob was trying to get his motorcycle ready for spring and started it in the garage. He then went inside and a neighbor came over yelling that his garage was on fire. Bob grabbed a fire extinguisher and tried to put out the fire. In the process he suffered burns to his left arm, shoulder, and head. Most are 2nd degree with a couple of spots that are 3rd degree. He said he barely got out in time. The house is heavily damaged.

This is a very traumatic time for the Carders and they will have many needs arise that may not be covered by insurance. If you would like to give a special gift to them you can email me at centerpointediscipleship@comcast.net
Please make it a priority to pray for them regularly and if you can help during this time please email me! if you would like to encourage the family post your comments here and we will make sure he sees them!

Where does this fit in your church?

2007-03-15T10:09:00.000-06:00

In our traditional church model, can you tell me how your church applies this verse?
"When you meet together, one will sing, another will teach, another will tell some special revelation God has given, one will speak in tongues, and another will interpret what is said. But everything that is done must strengthen all of you."1Corinthians 14:26

In your church service do you share how God has worked in your life this past week? Do others? Share with us how your church allows attenders to become participators in building up their brothers and sisters in Christ.

Which would you prefer: A Scalpel or a Broadsword?

2007-03-14T11:07:00.000-06:00

I have in my Bible study of late become more and more intuned to the fact that ALL of life is a matter of the heart. Everything pertains to the heart. This is how God made us, to be creatures of the heart, to live out of the heart, to love out of the heart, to experience joy out of the heart. Our parenting, our relationship with our spouse, our relationships in our workplace. All of who we are is from our heart. In the Bible so much is spoken about how the heart dictates the flow of our lives.
Because of this understanding I have come to the realization and the questions that follow:
If the heart is key to our lives, why do we rely on a church/church event or service to help us with our hearts? You see as I look back over time and see how the church has developed I have come to realize that the church God created in the New Testament was a scalpel, and we have taken that to a broadsword. Let me explain, if you went to see a cardiologist because there was some issue with your heart, you would not allow him to do surgery with a broadsword, nor would you allow him to try to perform heart surgery on a group of 300 at one time. In the context of the New Testament God called us to be makers of disciples, and the process of making disciples is done in a much smaller context (my preference is one on one) yet we have created the atmosphere where we call everyone to a service or event, and the speaker swings a broadsword at your heart to try to help you change it, to allow God to mold it… and in the process many leave with a heart condition that cannot be healed because of the sword rather than the scalpel.
Now more programs have been added to the church to try to resolve this condition, programs like Sunday school, Small groups, Youth groups and children's groups. We have women's Bible Study and Men's Bible Study, breakfasts and brunches… well you get the idea, and these are not bad things, and for some they have helped, but for most they are ineffective. At some point two things must happen as I see it in order for this to change:
1)The church goers must in themselves realize that what they are currently receiving is not sufficient to change their heart condition in many aspects of life…(I do not mean salvation per say, but rather the WHOLE of life that God has for them) or to help them grow to the potential God has for them. This realization must lead them to a disciplemaking, disciple driven ministry, where they can connect with a disciple maker who will pour themselves into their lives.
2)The church as it sits right now needs to put down her broadsword and pick up a scalpel and begin to move away from the event focused "come here to get" ministry to a disciple generating ministry where discipleship is more important than the size/numbers of your congregation or the size/numbers of attenders on a given Sunday Morning.
Neither of these things are easy to grasp, but I know many who are struggling and are beginning to see a need for change, changes in their own lives that they are not finding answers to in the church as they attend it now.

It would be so helpful to many who are dealing with these type issues if you would share your story with us, what do you think, are you being discipled by someone? Are you discipling someone? Do you think church as it is right now is discipling you? Do you wish someone would take the time to disciple you? These are questions many are facing with no one to help them hash it out, post a comment and help someone else (maybe even yourself).

Carl Van Vliet

Community

2007-03-07T18:48:00.000-06:00

On one of the Blog's I frequently find my self reading I found this excellent article on authentic community:

Before modern chemistry was king, there was alchemy, an ancient science that sought, among other things, to change base metals like lead into precious gold. The eighth century alchemist, Jabir Ibn Hayyan, suggested that properly rearranging the hotness, coldness, dryness, and moistness of one metal would transform it into another kind of metal. Sounds silly from the viewpoint of modern science, doesn't it?
But in the 20th century, churches began attempting to engineer community in much the same way. By properly arranging location, building design, music production, speaking style, and other elements, it was thought that authentic community could be sparked into existence. Much of that belief still influences the churches we see today.

Jump over Hungry and thirsty to read the rest of this excellent article called Contrived Community:

Hungry and Thirsty

Where do you fit?

2007-03-07T10:15:00.000-06:00

Where do you see yourself in God's plan? Is it as a spectator, perusing God's workmanship like a person peruses an art Gallery viewing and thinking "I wish I had that piece on my wall". Or is it as a character, a part or the portrait God is painting. Where people peruse how God has painted you and wish that your painting was on the wall of their life?
It is in your place in His plan that community is developed, and lives are changed. If you see yourself as a peruser rather than a participant then you miss out on much God has for your life.
Won't you join me in the participation in God's plan, or would you rather continue perusing your way through life looking and longing for what God is painting in the lives of others?

Common?

2007-03-07T08:57:00.000-06:00

Common

There is a passage of scripture that used to give me great comfort, and in ways it still does, but these days I find it less comforting as I see it in light of a different understanding. Let me share if I may:

In the book of First Corinthians 10 and verse 13 the Bible says no temptation has seized you (come over you/grabbed hold of you) except what is common to man…(KJV) (the NLT puts it: the temptations in your life are no different than what others experience) Now I used to find that comforting, that the things in life I deal with, am tempted by, or struggle with are things that everyone else has to deal with as well. There was a connection then for me to not feel alone, someone else has been there done that and is wearing the teeshirt today after having gone through it. That thought I much enjoyed entertaining in my head. I gained even greater comfort as I dealt with things in my own life, family, and relationships by that passage as it continues that God will provide a way out from the temptation (situation).

Funny thing about that which is common to man I have found: WHAT MAY BE COMMON TO MANKIND IS CERTAINLY UNIQUE TO THE INDIVIDUAL GOING THROUGH IT! (capitalized for emphasis) The comfort for me recently has been shred by the new understanding that it matters little what someone else has gone through when I am going through it alone. It makes the situation now unique to me, the common is gone. It decreased my comfort even more to come to more of an understanding than ever before that God works through people. His primary vehicle to touch lives today is through His people. Yet still this unique thing I am going through I go through alone because the vehicle God uses to make my unique common, the vehicle God uses to provide my way of escape from is a vehicle broke down on the side of the road. I say this because we have replaced real relationships with church attendance. We see people so little in our suburban busy lives we have little time to share something that could be common,
but is now unique.

I wish that we would spend more time in peoples lives and less time in the pews, and we could very well make all our situation/temptations common as a community of faith and make them less unique to the individual going through them! And maybe then we could hold each other up and be God's answer to get through it.

What do you think?

I have made a mistake

2007-02-28T12:15:00.001-06:00

I have made a mistake. Seems I often have to say those words, in my marriage, my parenting, my life with Christ, and my life of trying to be who God created me to be. I have made a mistake. You see as I posted earlier in my very first post, I am a Pastor. I have the heart of a Pastor, the heart of a Shepard. I long to see people experience joy in Christ, find freedom in Christ, enjoy life again, or maybe just find life more than what it is for them today.
I was also a Bible college, Institutional church/traditional church trained Pastor. Because of that these last months of deconstruction from that which I was, towards what I am has caused my mistake. You see before I launched into this blog, before I accepted a nudge from God to begin to go back into ministry I was in ministry. I was strategically discipling people God had placed in my life, I was doing lunch meetings, breakfast meetings, dinner meetings and helping people in the ways I described above.
Then I said I was starting a new church and something happened. Many people began to see that as a threat to "their church". Many people saw that as an attempt like so many others before them had done to "get them in the doors" and in fact it was. I am sorry to say when my family and I decided on this path our intention was to begin to disciple families, to begin to minister to peoples needs by pouring our lives into theirs, And then my mind took over. By that I mean I began to start using opportunities to disciple as opportunities to promote "coming" to a Bible study hosted in my home, and while our intention and our heart was in the right place, my old nature of "church" just kind of took over.

So now my wife and I (well really me because she somehow lovingly helped me realize my mistake) are going back to the beginning. For those whom I have talked with about a new church I am sorry, this is about US being the church, and helping people go deeper in their faith,and become more of the people that God created them to be: as husbands/wives, and parents, and individuals, as workers and employers, and last but not least… as followers of Christ. For those of you whom God has given us to speak into your lives I say thank you. Thank you for understanding that I am human and as such am prone to mistakes, and to say thank you for giving me and Liela and our family continued opportunity to share our faith with you on an ongoing basis!

So: who's over for dinner next?

Comments? please feel free to share them here!

Lost in America

2007-02-18T08:48:00.000-06:00

Our bookshelves are full of Christian books. We have church buildings on every major street, more paid staff in church buildings than ever before, large sunday school departments, cell systems, mega and meta church growth seminars.

We have fish on cars and bumperstickers, political action groups, huge parachurch ministries and extensive social programs. We have built huge churches, ministries, universities, and homes... and in the midst of it all we have lost every major city in North America.

Our paid church staff and major Christian leaders say were doing great things for God and for people, yet the statistics do not lie, they tell us a different story... a story of people hurt and alone, many in that very position because of the "church". We have drawn our line in the sand and said all who are like us on this side and all who are not go over there on the other side.

Our ideology of bridge building to that other side of the line is a bridge marked by the word "change". It is a label placed their by the select on "our" side for those on the otherside to do in order to make it across.

I say it is a label for the very ones who placed it there, it is a call to change in the church, it is a call to walk out of your precious building, walk out of your precious church service and walk across that bridge that divides them and us and to begin to be real, and begin to have real relationships with people. After all that is what God planned, all of the Bible, every single bit of it revolves around this story about a God who sooooooo strongly desires to be in a relationship with people. And we have reduced that to those who have "arrived".

I, and my family are crossing this bridge, we are venturing forth into real relationships with normal everyday people, is there anyone else out there doing the same? Tell us about your journey

I am a conservative, but not in the way you might think...

2007-02-12T19:37:00.000-06:00

I am a conservative. So often we want to see a persons label, are you liberal, are you conservative, are you a Christian or are you a (insert label here)? our labels go far beyond those I just mentioned, they go into Christendom... are you a baptist or a pentecostal, lutheran or methodist, catholic or (again insert label here)

Labels are a funny thing, we buy cloths because of labels, shop in certain stores, or dont shop in certain stores because of them. And we love people, or should I say we dont love people because of them. You know what I mean, we are stereotypical because of certain bents we have toward different things; things like what area a person lives, what kind of music an individual listens to, what is the color of their skin, what school di or do they go to. Even things like what denomination they are. But the one we so easily stereotype is the one I began with, are you a liberal or a conservative, are you moderate with your views or are you radical with them.

It is funny to watch how easy it is to stereotype a liberal because of their beliefs... but you know what, the Christian conservative is stereotyped as well. Have you ever thought that that stereotype is causing us to loose our right to speak the life and words of Jesus into peoples lives? Have you ever thought that our hootin and hollerin has denied us the chance to be the very thing Jesus called us to be. We conservatives Christians boycott everything under the sun that doesnt line up with our theology. we boycott lost people being lost because we dont like how lost people act. we boycott secular business because they do what secular business' do, they sell things. we just only want them to sell to "right behaving people"

Scripture tells me that the community of faith God created and called His own was a people group that "had favor among all the people" (see Acts 2 in the Bible). how do we have favor enough to speak into anyones life the power of a Great God to transform situations and struggles... to transform the very life of those we seek to impact, when we have no favor, and we have been stereotyped with every other "non favor" weilding Christian.

I would rather have favor and the ability to speak when God give the oppertunity than I would to have my label. So I am laying down my label, I am not a conservative, I am not a part of a denomination, dont call me a Christian; call me a God lover and a God servant, call me a people servant. That didnt change my beliefs or my desires. I would still vote the same, I would still teach the same, still raise my children the same, but I would strive to change the world through touching individual lives God gives me favor with rather than lumping myself in with the stereotypical conservative Christian which our world simply disregards anyway!

So whats your label? Tell me about it.

2007-02-12T19:27:00.001-06:00

2007-02-12T18:50:00.000-06:00

In his book, The Monday Morning Church, Jerry Cook tells the story of a conversation with Dr. Richard Halverson, formerly the chaplain of the United States Senate and the pastor of a large Presbyterian church in Washington, D.C. After speaking in a seminary chapel service, he engaged some of the students in conversation over coffee in the cafeteria. Cook relates the following…
“We get together at a building on Fourth Street, but we don’t spend much time there. We’re mostly in the city.”One of the students asked, “Dr. Halverson, where is your church?” This seemed like a perfectly reasonable question to me, but Dr. Halverson looked quite perplexed and hesitated to answer. Then he glanced at his watch.“Well, it’s three o’clock in Washington, D.C. The church I pastor is all over the city. It’s driving buses, serving meals in restaurants, having discussions in the Pentagon, deliberating in the Congress.” He knew exactly where his church was, and he went on and on with his lengthy listing. Then he added, “Periodically, we get together at a building on Fourth Street, but we don’t spend much time there. We’re mostly in the city.”
(see the whole article at http://www.missionalchallenge.blogspot.com/)

What an interesting concept dont you think

2007-02-11T09:02:00.000-06:00

Life is a journey and it is not Christian or non Christian, it is fellow sojourners of a faith journey. Statistics from Barna research group point to 68% of all adults are “spiritual” including 55% of people who classify themselves as “non born again” that is people who have not made a confession of faith in Christ for salvation. Research also points to 66% (2/3rds) of all adults are “searching for meaning and purpose for their lives”. In a typical week 63% of unchurched people, that is people who are not part of a faith community say they pray regularly in a typical week. Everyone is on a faith journey, and everyone is at a different place in their faith journey.

Paul Points us to the beginning of that journey in the Bible: Romans 12:3 “Everyone who is among you should not think of himself more highly than he ought to, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.”

As God has dealt each one a measure of faith. Paul is not talking about “Christians” this is the misconception in the church that no one has faith until they receive Christ. But that is incorrect; God has dealt to everyone a measure of faith, a beginning point of every persons faith journey was begun by God. God fired the starters pistol to your journey!

It is this measure of faith that allows all people the ability to believe their paycheck has any value to it, after all it is simply a piece of paper. It is this measure of faith that allows all people to believe what a Dr. prescribes for you will make you feel better. It is this measure of faith that starts all people on a journey of faith, it is what allows those statistics I quoted earlier to be true And it is this measure of faith that allows you and I and every person on this planet the ability to believe Jesus came to die to bring life here on the earth!

Many people have never gotten off the starting line, they never get beyond the measure of faith and they try to live on that measure alone. Then they struggle with questions like “why do bad things happen to good people” why do I keep facing trouble and trials and difficulty in my life” etc etc etc. you get the picture.

People on the starting line can be far in their journey of life, but never have really started. They can believe in God, or a higher power, a supreme being, they can pray, they can attend faith gatherings like church or bible studies, or other religious activities like attend mass or go to a mosque. All in the attempt to get off the line, yet never quite making it. Many will pursue great spirituality in their attempt to move on in their faith journey; things like astrology, their daily horoscope, the tarot reader, and many other “spiritual” practices, they might even serve in the nursery in their church… but the truth is since God designed the journey of faith the journey must at some point bring one to the starting gun, the thing which allows you to move off the starting line.

We are inviting people back to the starting line, back to just the measure of faith instilled in them from their birth, and begin this journey together with us as we walk through life together as sojourners, travelers of life.

Does anyone out there relate to such a journey? Tell us about your journey by clicking on the post a comment link!

Futbol anyone

2007-02-10T08:16:00.000-06:00

I have found myself really busy in the last few weeks. Soccer season is in full swing and I coach three teams, well five in a sense, two are playing indoor right now, and three will be playing outdoor in just a few weeks. Last weekend my 13 year old team got it handed to them on the soccerfield. This team is a first year team, have never played together before, and my son played goalie for the first time ever. they played aainst a team that went 7-1-0 last season in A division (the highest division). we play in C division (the lowest). We lost 24 to 0 and their heads were hanging very low. I wondered if I would even be able to get them back on the field for the next game. they resorted to trash talking their own team for such a loss.

At the end of the game it is my job as coach to have a talk with the kids about the game... half my team just left and went home. But the half that stayed got to hear on of my best pep talks (sermons to the team if you will). I spoke to them about the journey, not the destination. You see their minds were on winning, but mine was on their becoming something. Becoming a team, a unit, a community if you will grant me some latitude with the word. learning their names, their skill, their weakness, their positions and most of all... a mutual respect for each other. you see when this happens the other comes, games begin to be won, friendships developed, and we shine! You see, when we learn to be a team we can compliment eachothers strengths and weaknesses for the greater good. we start thinking in terms of the team rather than "me". we start acting in such a way, and playing such a way that the team is benefited...

I think God would smile at that, if His people functioned like that. thinking of the community instead of onesself, learning to compliment each others lives, haveing ours eyes off heaven and onto becoming something... You see I think that IS what God wanted. More of the Bible's teaching is about becoming a community of faith than is found therein about heaven. And eternal life is described as beginning at the point of Christ meeting, not the point of death. We have focused on the destination rather than the journey. more on where we were going than on who we were to be. I pray my soccer team can enjoy becomeing instead of despairing the destination, and likewise I pray the church would spend less time on the destination and more time on the journey!

BTW we play again today @ 4pm, I'll get my team manager to shoot some photo's and I'll post a few! GO EXTREME!

Do we view our faith through the eyes of our mind, or our heart?

2007-01-26T17:52:00.000-06:00

I think I have learned a secret, a secret so profound it has been oft overlooked in dealing with faith. But not just any ole faith the faith of the church. You see I am finding large numbers of people who are interested in spiritual things. People who are looking for angels, demons, ghost... looking to astrological signs, fortune tellers, palm readers, or churches. Yes I lumped the churches into the "trial" areas of peoples search for the supernatural. Hence the reason shows like "Ghost Wisperer" or Touched By an Angel, movies like the craft and covenant have a large following. People desperatly want something to believe in, and some will believe in anything in the hopes of finding the supernatural, the spiritual.

Paul encountered this in a huge proportion in Ephesus, where he stayed for over two years. Ephesus was the hub of magical and supernatural power seekers of all of Asia Minor. People were hungry then and they are hungry now. I find it interesting that Paul prayed for the people of Ephesus "that the eyes of their hearts would be enlightened" (opened) because it is there that real spirituality is found.

Today we as church leaders have focused on the going: go to this church cause it has the real presence of God, go to this church to find your destiny, go to this church to find your home. But the whole Bible has little to say about the going, yet the people of the Bible placed so much emphasis on it, and the people of today are spending so much time on it that tey (both the old and the now) have missed the journey. I believe that is why Jesus spent so much time outside the "place" and inside the "lives" of those He touched. people who are spiritually hungry are not looking for a place, they are looking for a person and the vehicle that God chose to share His love and power was not a place (though it was called the church) it was people. People living together in faith is where true spirituallity is found, not in a building. now I am not against gathering in a building provided that gathering does not become the focus, the faith journey found in the community of people living life as a family is the focus, and should be the focus now and in the future!

I have heard so many sermons on the errors of those found in the Bible (sins if you will) and about how they were put in the Bible for us to learn from so we wouldnt make the same mistakes. I wonder if the Inspired God put those people in there to tell us something else. I believe He was telling us He loves us and He loves people who are not perfect. people who make mistakes, people who sin. thats what community is all about, "normal" people becoming Gods people, and showing other "normal" people how they can become Gods people too.

Find the spiritual outside the walls of a building, find it in community, find it in "THE Church"

Message from a Non believer

2007-01-22T20:58:00.001-06:00

This post is from comments on annother blog I frequent: Bob Carder - The Planter from a non believer. I am posting his comments and my response. I would love to hear from more like him who are honest and upfront.
David said:
Hi, I'm a non-believer, so I hope you don't mind if the "world" intrudes into your Christian sphere a little.In recent years, I have re-newed my interest in spiritual matters, including the Christian faith. First impression: From my experiences interacting with Christians in blogs like this, there is no such thing as radical transformation. Christians have no deeper understanding of life. They are not spirituality more advanced/mature than other people. Christianity merely appears to be a source of deep emotional comfort - but Christians have no clear answer to controlling emotions and developing healthy emotional lives.Second impression: Christians are not really interested in talking to the world about their message. Sure, they will reply to questions occasionally, but few will take the time to really engage in meaningful dialogue with non-Christians. Christians seem to be more interested in re-arranging the chairs on the Titanic, or desparately trying to stop the collapse of their faith in the Western world.Third impression: I've also looked at other faiths, especially Buddhism. What I found surprising, was that Buddhists are interested in engaging with the world, have very practical strategies for developing better lives, personally and socially, have a clear, analytical and relational philosophy. All this without the "Jesus saves" gobbledy-gook proffered by Christianity.

Carls Response:
David,
I appreciate your candidness, the church needs to hear from more people such as yourself. I for one am listening and would love to hear more. If I may address some of your comments:Christianinty has become the icon of American History, and as such many have claimed Christianity as their heritage. Church attendance has for many become the act of claiming their heritage without the substance of Christ. Likewise if Christianity has become the icon of American History then the Bible has become the icon of Christianity, and as such the Bible can be found in over 90% of the homes in America (usually dust covered and unread). The church has taken the life found in the Bible and reduced it to spiritual truths of ages past, and God has been reduced to the God who did instead of the God who does and is doing.The Bible does infact contain the answers to your questions regarding developing healthy emotions. You see once we remove the icon status and once again begin to see the Bible as the inspired, living word of God it can and does transform lives, emotions, marraiges... etc.For many the idea of talking to the world about the Christian message is reduced to sharing their American Heritage: "well I'm a Christian" but the backbone, the crux of real Christianity goes much deeper than that, unfortunatly many simply only embrace it as the past rather than the now.Many of us have no desire to try to stop the collapse of that kind of faith because some of us believe that that kind of faith must collapse in order for the living faith in our Lord Jesus Christ to be revealed in the lives of those living in a powerless rote of tradition they call faith.I prefer to not run around with all the Jesus saves gobbledy gook, I would rather live that Jesus Saved and transformed my life and you can live victorious today too... victoriously in your emotions, your marraige, your finances, all your life wholly. And I would love the oppertunity to share with you how.The Bible is full of practical strategies for developing better lives and it differes from buddhism in that it is found in a relationship, not in a set of behaviors.Thank you for sharing with us please come and share more, or as the scripture says "come let us reason together"

So anybody want to share their hearts on these issues? Post a comment!

What does it mean to belong?

2007-01-21T08:54:00.000-06:00

So what does it really mean to belong? I often struggled with this while pastoring in the traditional church setting, because I oft found my own views did not match those of the church, or the denmination.

Allow me to explain:

Our church required in its constitution and by-laws that the only way for one to belong, I.E. "be a member" was to accept a set statement of faith and embrace the doctrine of the church, and/or make a confession of faith and be baptized. While I am all for a person making such a confession, and I am certainly all for baptism I simply do not see this model described in scripture. What I do find was Jesus traveling the countryside inviting people to come and follow, and then he taught them along the way and their lives were transformed through the following, and through the belonging. I dont find Jesus saying "hey come follow me, but first you have to accept my set position on things, and then you can follow me." He calls, people follow, transformation comes after, not before.

A community of faith is one where ALL peoples, at ALL stages of their faith's journey should be able to belong, and grow. From the person who does not believe there is a God to the believer of 30 years who thinks they have it all figured out, and every spot on the journey in between. It is in the belonging that believing and transformation come.

Starving Artist's or God's paintbrush?

2007-01-20T16:18:00.000-06:00

I just had dinner with a young 30 somethings family last night in our home... As we sat over coffee after dinner, while the xbox roared in the background from all the kids (8 fully enjoying the gaming experience, well most were enjoying the gaming experience:P) I began to share the vision for a movement without walls, without platforms or platform ministers and without programs. We talked about how exciting this sounded, how discipleship is what they desire in their own lives and the lives of their chldren. After about an how or so the hammer dropped...

"so what will it look like?"

I had just spent an hour describing what it would be like, only to realize that we are uterly clueless as to what it will look like. While we have wonderful concepts of the disciple making process, and we have an awesome vision, it simply cannot be painted on a canvas like a Norman Rockwell special edition. It cannot be sold at a starving artist closeout at the local exhibition center like a sofa size painting for $19.99.

I tried to explain, I dont know what it will look like, I mean how do you describe a ministry with no walls, no programs, no Sunday Sermon, no stage or band, only people... and thats just how you describe it, its people!

God is such an awesome painter, He uses wide brushes, skinny ones, he uses oil paints and watercolors and they blend so well when He does it. And those paintings are people, short people, tall people, married people and single people, people with broken hearts and people with Big hearts ready to love... what better description could I give than one that paints a visual picture of how much God loves every person. And God wants us to pour our lives into people, not things like buildings. Not things like programs, just loving people! thats what we're here to do, to love people into the Kingdom of God.

It takes God to be able to paint this picture on the hearts of those He calls to join us and I love to watch Him paint.

2007-01-18T21:04:00.000-06:00

I thought Church was a thing of the past for me, and for my family. ..

What a strange way to start a post on a blog for a new church... Let me explain, the church as it looks today with its priorities on services, programs and buildings was, and is a thing of the past for me and my family. I Pastored for 14 years in that setting and found that much was wasted on writing sermons instead of meeting people. Holding business meetings and making sure the order of service was right instead of sharing my life with people. Oh yes we had great services and I preached great messages (I know because as people shook my hand as they left the building they told me so:) ) and then I would work on next weeks service, or the new worship song, or the next come and see event, or the... well the list is endless. And such was my life, the life of a Pastor.

When I left that life over a year ago I had every intention of never pastoring again, yet here I am, launching out into the deep of that very thing, Pastoring... but not like you would think when you think of that word, that job description. This time there is no sermons to write, no order of service, shucks, there isnt even a building, there is just a deep desire to see lives changed, to see families changed, to help people live, survive, and even thrive in this world we live in. And you know what, we just might learn what it really means to "BE" the church along the way.

So have you ever thought about what church would be like without a building, or service, or the great "programs" like youth ministry and childrens ministry? Might it look like "a family"? well thats kind of what it should look like, a family with crying babies and antcy children, and even the ocasional bored teenager... or maybe it would not have any crying babies, or antcy children, or bored teenagers at all (well probably crying babies) because maybe, just maybe they are hungry for a real relationship with God too? maybe they long for the environment to see their entire family striving to make their sunday faith real... and maybe, just maybe it would be life changing for them to see.

What do you think???